Originally Posted by cotton man

I totally agree with all that the council wishes to do about the control of dogs. All dogs should be muzzled and on a lead in public places.
Two weeks ago I was almost knocked of my bike by a dog running out of trees at the side of the nature reserve path. The owners were screaming at dog to return to them, orders which it ignored.
Over the years I have had problems whilst running and riding with dogs and so have many of members of cycling groups. Last summer I watched a young woman being harassed by an out of control dog while exercising her horse on the beach. Again the owners were miles away and their "control "was useless. Dogs must be on leads and kept of the nature reserve, beaches parks and children's play areas.

Although I sympathise with some of your experiences, why on earth should all dogs be muzzled?

Originally Posted by Seashells&sand

Although I sympathise with some of your experiences, why on earth should all dogs be muzzled?

Because dogs bite, they will bite people and other dogs.

Not too long ago a lady doctor was walking her dog in a park off Liverpool Road Ainsdale when she and her dog sustained serious bite injuries by a three dogs with a male owner who was unable to control his dogs. As usual the male "responsible owner" left the area as soon as the serious injuries were seen and people came to the lady doctors aid. As I understand she had to go to hospital and very expensive vets bills had to be paid.

None of this would have happened if all dogs were muzzled. Incidentally all dogs in public places in Poland have to be on a lead and muzzled.

I hope this answers your question.

The irresponsible and inconsiderate dog owners have created the problems, everyone has to comply, tough.

My favourite hate is those stupid ball throwing sticks, very often used by people whose aim and sense of direction is variable at best and usually a pain in the rear at worst, having had the pleasure of a bloody dog diving under a buggy with a child in, the dog in hot pursuit of a ball aimlessly thrown by a female who simply couldn't understand why I was less than amused, no apology or concern for the then very young child. This woman continued her throwing in a haphazard fashion, until I informed her that if another ball came near me it would go in the lake, hopefully followed by the dog.

Originally Posted by silver fox

The irresponsible and inconsiderate dog owners have created the problems, everyone has to comply, tough.

My favourite hate is those stupid ball throwing sticks, very often used by people whose aim and sense of direction is variable at best and usually a pain in the rear at worst, having had the pleasure of a bloody dog diving under a buggy with a child in, the dog in hot pursuit of a ball aimlessly thrown by a female who simply couldn't understand why I was less than amused, no apology or concern for the then very young child. This woman continued her throwing in a haphazard fashion, until I informed her that if another ball came near me it would go in the lake, hopefully followed by the dog.

The attitude of your "responsible owner" you encountered is typical.

Originally Posted by Seashells&sand

Haha I was thinking the same thing. Never, in all my years have I experienced this!!

haha me to,my Samoyed gives a look to kill if so much as chuff,cant stop laughing,defo not a knicker changer there ! all humps wecome here though haha!

Originally Posted by silver fox

having had the pleasure of a bloody dog diving under a buggy with a child in, the dog in hot pursuit of a ball aimlessly thrown by a female who simply couldn't understand why I was less than amused, .

Many dog owners seem to assume that the rest of the world thinks their dog is as wonderful as they do. Usually women who treat the dog as a substitute child.

Here is a better idea. All parents should be made to keep their offspring on a child safety harness and under their control at all times until they are 18 years old. That would solve the problem of gangs of youths hanging around causing trouble and intimidating innocent members of the public which is a far greater problem but no, pick on law abiding people trying to have a pleasant walk with their dog.

Now obviously I don't have children but I do have a dog and he is not a threat to anyone and has been brought up properly to have manners and to obey commands. This stupid law will just create more dangerous and out of control dogs dancing around at the end of a lead, especially high energy working breeds. Not to mention the cruelty aspect of it - NEVER being able to let your dog have proper exercise. Number 4 of the RSPCA Five Freedoms is: Freedom to express normal behaviour: by providing sufficient space, proper facilities and company of the animal’s own kind and Number 5: Freedom from fear and distress: by ensuring conditions and treatment which avoid mental suffering. So therefore, by bringing in this law, every dog owner will be breaking the 2006 Animal Welfare Act. I know which law I will be breaking, it won't be a difficult choice.

I do agree that in places like Botanic Gardens/Hesketh Park dogs should be on leads and I have never let my dog off there as there is a higher concentration of families, children and elderly people enjoying the parks and the ponds with the waterfowl. However, the beach or the sand dunes or the big playing field at Kew or the other playing fields around town I don't see a problem. For much of the week these are empty and the only people on there are dog walkers!

I have to admit that I am not at all fond of dogs.

Apart from being allergic, to short haired dogs, I really am not at all fond of any dogs.

I would certainly prefer all dogs to be on a lead when out in public.

Why is it that people think they have a right to exercise their dog on public property, animals should be exercised on their own property. Anybody who says that they don't have space obviously have an animal that is too big, that is animal cruelty. All dogs should be muzzled in public and on proper leads not these extendable ones.

Originally Posted by aqua31

Now obviously I don't have children but I do have a dog and he is not a threat to anyone and has been brought up properly to have manners and to obey commands. This stupid law will just create more dangerous and out of control dogs dancing around at the end of a lead, especially high energy working breeds. Not to mention the cruelty aspect of it - NEVER being able to let your dog have proper exercise. Number 4 of the RSPCA Five Freedoms is: Freedom to express normal behaviour: by providing sufficient space, proper facilities and company of the animal’s own kind and Number 5: Freedom from fear and distress: by ensuring conditions and treatment which avoid mental suffering. So therefore, by bringing in this law, every dog owner will be breaking the 2006 Animal Welfare Act. I know which law I will be breaking, it won't be a difficult choice.

!

Perhaps high energy working breeds should not be kept as pets.

Originally Posted by aqua31

I do agree that in places like Botanic Gardens/Hesketh Park dogs should be on leads and I have never let my dog off there as there is a higher concentration of families, children and elderly people enjoying the parks and the ponds with the waterfowl. However, the beach or the sand dunes or the big playing field at Kew or the other playing fields around town I don't see a problem. For much of the week these are empty and the only people on there are dog walkers!

There is your problem source, far too many think it's OK for their dogs to run free in parks and I would also think many who use the playing fields for sports would not agree with you.

having run over a few dogs over the years , and seen a few run over myself and cause accidents , it looks like the use of leads needs to be enforced ...

Originally Posted by Knot wright

having run over a few dogs over the years , and seen a few run over myself and cause accidents , it looks like the use of leads needs to be enforced ...

No to mention the multiple daily appeals from owners on Facebook asking for help locating their missing dogs

Originally Posted by aqua31

. This stupid law will just create more dangerous and out of control dogs dancing around at the end of a lead, especially high energy working breeds. Not to mention the cruelty aspect of it - NEVER being able to let your dog have proper exercise. Number 4 of the RSPCA Five Freedoms is: Freedom to express normal behaviour: by providing sufficient space, proper facilities and company of the animal’s own kind and Number 5: Freedom from fear and distress: by ensuring conditions and treatment which avoid mental suffering.

I do agree that in places like Botanic Gardens/Hesketh Park dogs should be on leads and I have never let my dog off there as there is a higher concentration of families, children and elderly people enjoying the parks and the ponds with the waterfowl. However, the beach or the sand dunes or the big playing field at Kew or the other playing fields around town I don't see a problem. For much of the week these are empty and the only people on there are dog walkers!

High energy working dogs are not suitable for home life - i would imagine the ones you are talking about are gun dogs and cattle dogs - both of which gain exercise from their working life on the farms !

The law is not to never let your dog have exercise - just to keep them on the lead in public areas !! The beach already has a restriction on it as does Victoria park - although dog owners ignore this !

Freedom from fear and distress - many dogs are fearful of their own kind or have been attacked by others ! If dogs were kept on a lead around others - dog attacks would be reduced !! As to the RSPCA freedoms - you will find most of those are broken by dog owners anyway. How many owners have just one dog ? How many live in a tiny flat or house ? How many owners treat their dogs like children and not dogs and therefore don't like it when they actually act like dogs ??

You don't see the problem of letting your dog off the lead at Kew ? It is a playing field where children and adults play - not a dog walking field !! There is also waterfowl on that field due to the nearby waterways.

As for the dunes - how many dogs have gone missing over there because they have run from their owners sight or have chased a rabbit !

You strike me as a very arrogant and inconsiderate dog owner !

Many dog owners are lazy and take their dogs for a walk on the nearest green space regardless of its use ! They can't be bothered taking them far. Many also can't be bothered training their dogs and assume a dog will behave without any training ! It is why you see so many 2 year old + dogs in kennels - because they reach the troublesome age and owners wonder why they are mis-behaving after being left to their own devices !!

A dog is a dog and not a child !!

This is a rare occasion... for once I agree with Sefton Council (Oops forgive me "Liverpool City Region"). Having experienced numerous irresponsible dog-walkers on the footpaths around Southport....... I'll especially mention the footpath across Hesketh Golf Club... there are some dog owners who need lining up against a wall!!!
Whilst the vast majority of dog owners are entirely responsible there's a minority of complete and utter morons........ They're happlessley willing to allow their dogs to run out of control causing damage to other peoples property and a dangerous nuisance to other members of the public!
A dangerous and out of control dog on private property, causing damage or worrying livestock can be "shot" on site. A point worth noting to the muppet dog owners who think they can exercise their dogs where they want...... You know who you are...
Meanwhile my gun-dogs are ALWAYS under control........