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  1. Quote Originally Posted by seivad View Post
    That's not a plan, it's a failure, and one that the majority of politicians want to avoid.


    Surely you can see by now that there is nobody who can lead the UK through this process and come out of the other side relatively unscathed. If you couldn't see it before, you should certainly see it now. I've never seen such a dearth of ability in British politicians.
    Politician's have a short shelf life anyway.
    Brexit is the main objective even if it means 'no deal'.

    I don't see the problem as about 'ability' in Politician's.
    Brexit is difficult with all the challenges.

    The UK survived New Labour and all the social economic and political upheaval's from that reverberating today.

    If we stay in the EU we face all the problems and crisis that come with it.

  2. YOUR COMMENTS:


  3. Quote Originally Posted by gazaprop View Post
    Re your point on 'not having a vote' and 'democracy' - this from Winston Churchill - “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.” Ooooh Yes!
    :-)

  4. Does Parliament actually have a choice over the agreement

    Article 50.
    A Member State which decides to withdraw shall notify the European Council of its intention. In the light of the guidelines provided by the European Council, the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the framework for its future relationship with the Union. That agreement shall be negotiated in accordance with Article 218(3)[10] of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union. It shall be concluded on behalf of the Union by the Council [of the European Union], acting by a qualified majority, after obtaining the consent of the European Parliament.

    Does this mean that no deal is not an option, if don't accept the negotiated deal we remain?

  5. Quote Originally Posted by Alikado View Post
    Does Parliament actually have a choice over the agreement

    Article 50.
    A Member State which decides to withdraw shall notify the European Council of its intention. In the light of the guidelines provided by the European Council, the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the framework for its future relationship with the Union. That agreement shall be negotiated in accordance with Article 218(3)[10] of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union. It shall be concluded on behalf of the Union by the Council [of the European Union], acting by a qualified majority, after obtaining the consent of the European Parliament.

    Does this mean that no deal is not an option, if don't accept the negotiated deal we remain?
    In a word... no!

    Para. 3 of Article 50 states that after the 2 year negotiation period, you leave with or without a withdrawal agreement... unless an extension is negotiated.

    3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.


    The link below also confirms it.

    https://researchbriefings.parliament...mmary/CBP-8397

  6. Quote Originally Posted by seivad View Post
    In a word... no!

    Para. 3 of Article 50 states that after the 2 year negotiation period, you leave with or without a withdrawal agreement... unless an extension is negotiated.

    3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period.


    The link below also confirms it.

    https://researchbriefings.parliament...mmary/CBP-8397
    The way I read it is you leave with the deal negotiated, no mention of having it ratified locally.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Alikado View Post
    The way I read it is you leave with the deal negotiated, no mention of having it ratified locally.
    From the Parliamentary Briefing link:

    "If there is no UK request or no EU agreement to extend the negotiations, or if either the UK Parliament or the European Parliament or the other 27 EU Member States do not endorse the negotiated withdrawal agreement, there will be no ‘deal’ and the EU Treaties will no longer apply to the UK from 29 March 2019."

  8. Quote Originally Posted by Alikado View Post
    Does Parliament actually have a choice over the agreement

    Article 50.
    A Member State which decides to withdraw shall notify the European Council of its intention. In the light of the guidelines provided by the European Council, the Union shall negotiate and conclude an agreement with that State, setting out the arrangements for its withdrawal, taking account of the framework for its future relationship with the Union. That agreement shall be negotiated in accordance with Article 218(3)[10] of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union. It shall be concluded on behalf of the Union by the Council [of the European Union], acting by a qualified majority, after obtaining the consent of the European Parliament.

    Does this mean that no deal is not an option, if don't accept the negotiated deal we remain?

    They are making it up as they go along, So can do just about what they want at this time.


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