Trump or Corbyn?

[AdmiralAckbar]

Tolerance of other people's views has definitely deteriorated.

... now that is rich coming from you!!!

Late last year, I started posting again on this forum after a significant hiatus due to several factors.... and at that time I had the temerity to actually question one of your posts - you just took that as an opportunity to dump all over my responses, subsequently labeling me at every opportunity with derogatory references to left wing groups... I don't dispute my political leanings, but did object to the tone and content of a number of your responses clearly designed to discredit and debunk me as a "new" poster.

I wanted to make friends and have friendly debate, not enemies ... at one point I literally offered an olive branch in the hope that it would be an opportunity to tone down your toxic responses to me, but you were on such a high trying to discredit me you just used that opportunity to comically (using the word losely) tell me where I could stick it...

but you can stick your Olive Branch in the shaft of your Freedom-fighters gun!

In that same " Ooohh Jeremy Corbyn" thread you went on to accuse me of "back tracking" which I took objection to and challenged you to clarify and quantify which, despite me chasing you at every opportunity (I think it drifted into another thread as well) you couldn't because the accusation was unfounded.

So, as I said about your comment

Tolerance of other people's views has definitely deteriorated.

... it is a bit rich coming from you!!!

[Hamble]

... now that is rich coming from you!!!

Late last year, I started posting again on this forum after a significant hiatus due to several factors.... and at that time I had the temerity to actually question one of your posts - you just took that as an opportunity to dump all over my responses, subsequently labeling me at every opportunity with derogatory references to left wing groups... I don't dispute my political leanings, but did object to the tone and content of a number of your responses clearly designed to discredit and debunk me as a "new" poster.

I wanted to make friends and have friendly debate, not enemies ... at one point I literally offered an olive branch in the hope that it would be an opportunity to tone down your toxic responses to me, but you were on such a high trying to discredit me you just used that opportunity to comically (using the word losely) tell me where I could stick it...

In that same " Ooohh Jeremy Corbyn" thread you went on to accuse me of "back tracking" which I took objection to and challenged you to clarify and quantify which, despite me chasing you at every opportunity (I think it drifted into another thread as well) you couldn't because the accusation was unfounded.

So, as I said about your comment
... it is a bit rich coming from you!!!

Well thank you for your thought's on the subject of tolerance.

Do you feel a burning injustice of being accused of something you did not do?

If yes I will review all your posts and get back to you in the future.

If the answer is a no then you must try harder in the art of spar and fair discourse.

It helps to read a post carefully without jumping to conclusions or fixating on one poster to relieve misplaced pent up anger and frustration.

You do not strike me as the latter so I look forward to exchanging posts in the future.

[AdmiralAckbar]

I am surprised Labour supporters and 1 anarchist are ignorant of the fact some Nazi German company'S used slave labour in Concentration camps in Germany and Poland.

I thought you said you'd read this link ... https://twitter.com/BlogRedRobin

Here are a few extracts addressing your concerns regarding Nazi's and concentration camps ...

4). On the 23rd April 1977, Corbyn organised a counter-demonstration to protect Wood Green from a neo-nazi march through the district. The area had a significant Jewish population.

10). On the 24th March 2009, Corbyn signed a Parliamentary motion praising British Jews who resisted the Holocaust by risking their lives to save potential victims.

18). On the 9th January 2014, Jeremy Corbyn signed a Parliamentary motion praising Holocaust education programmes that had taken 20,000 British students to Auschwitz.

21). On the 3rd December 2016, Corbyn made a visit to Terezin Concentration Camp when Jewish people were murdered by the Nazis. It was Jeremy’s third visit to such a camp, all of which were largely unreported in the most read UK papers.


... no ignorance on our side my dear.

[Hamble]

I thought you said you'd read this link ... https://twitter.com/BlogRedRobin

Here are a few extracts addressing your concerns regarding Nazi's and concentration camps ...

4). On the 23rd April 1977, Corbyn organised a counter-demonstration to protect Wood Green from a neo-nazi march through the district. The area had a significant Jewish population.

10). On the 24th March 2009, Corbyn signed a Parliamentary motion praising British Jews who resisted the Holocaust by risking their lives to save potential victims.

18). On the 9th January 2014, Jeremy Corbyn signed a Parliamentary motion praising Holocaust education programmes that had taken 20,000 British students to Auschwitz.

21). On the 3rd December 2016, Corbyn made a visit to Terezin Concentration Camp when Jewish people were murdered by the Nazis. It was Jeremy’s third visit to such a camp, all of which were largely unreported in the most read UK papers.


... no ignorance on our side my dear.

Seriously?

Inappropriate post to me at this time on this thread.

[seivad]

That does not help put right what you have given me which is burning injustice.

I harboured none of the sentiments SF or you accused me of.
My replies were a follow on conversation against the accusation of MR BS that I had 'Nazi sympathy's for reading the 'Daily heil'.

I did not deserve the barrage of abuse from either of you.

Barrage of abuse from me? Can you please reread my responses to you, and point out where I have barraged you with abuse. I've reread them, and I can't see where I've abused you, nor was it my intent. On the contrary, I've agreed that you're perfectly entitled to boycott German products. And, as you should well know by now, I condemn all Nazi atrocities against the Jewish people. It sickens me.

Just to make it clear my comment to you "You are also a Labour Supporter' referred to you backing up SF and other Labour poster accusations on that thread.
I thought I pointed it out politely.It seems you took it on personally
by your replies and it also deepened the injustice.

Perhaps you should reread your own posts, and try and put yourself in the position of the person the post was directed at. You know what you meant, but that's not the way it comes across.

You are entitled to your bias(on backing up Labour opinion) and I do understand SF's and your sensitivities on the the subject but as I said
burning injustice just does not go away.

Had you directed your comments to anyone, and labelled them with a specific political party, I would have felt exactly the same way. You should understand that labelling people with anything is wrong. Race, religion, sexual orientation, political views.... the list goes on. People can't be neatly placed in little pigeon holes, with the belief that everything they say or do is a result of the label on that pigeon hole.

I didn't back up SF on the basis of him being a Labour supporter. I backed him up on the basis that he's a decent human being. And what on earth are our "sensitivities on the subject"?

My point was, and still is, that if you were shocked that certain people weren't aware of Nazi slave labour, you should have said "people", and not "Labour supporters". It's also compounded by the fact that you know that at least 2 of the Labour supporters are aware of it, and absolutely condemn it.

Words are powerful, choose them carefully.

[Hamble]

Barrage of abuse from me? Can you please reread my responses to you, and point out where I have barraged you with abuse. I've reread them, and I can't see where I've abused you, nor was it my intent. On the contrary, I've agreed that you're perfectly entitled to boycott German products. And, as you should well know by now, I condemn all Nazi atrocities against the Jewish people. It sickens me.


Perhaps you should reread your own posts, and try and put yourself in the position of the person the post was directed at. You know what you meant, but that's not the way it comes across.


Had you directed your comments to anyone, and labelled them with a specific political party, I would have felt exactly the same way. You should understand that labelling people with anything is wrong. Race, religion, sexual orientation, political views.... the list goes on. People can't be neatly placed in little pigeon holes with the belief that everything they say or do is a result of the label on that pigeon hole.

I didn't back up SF on the basis of him being a Labour supporter. I backed him up on the basis that he's a decent human being. And what on earth are our "sensitivities on the subject"?

My point was, and still is, that if you were shocked that certain people weren't aware of Nazi slave labour, you should have said "people", and not "Labour supporters". It's also compounded by the fact that you know that at least 2 of the Labour supporters are aware of it, and absolutely condemn it.

Words are powerful, choose them carefully.

I said 'Labour supporters and one anarchist' because they were the posters on this thread who
1. posted a cartoon of Nazi's and referenced the Daily heil.
2. Speculated my choice not to buy German goods was 'racist'
3. Made accusations of intent I did not harbour.

No far right or Tory posted.

It is all very well in hindsight telling me what I should and should not have put you must bear in mind because my intent was innocent I had no idea why and where you and SF were going with this.

If I was guilty of your allegations then I view the discussion from my point of view in an even worse light than the principle.

Until your posts I was not aware Mr BS (being a new poster)knew that I was Jewish.
I was giving is distasteful comments and cartoons fair reply until SF jumped in.

Why don't you re read the thread this time from my point of view not SF's?

[Toodles McGinty]

burning injustice just does not go away.

But you choose to support the Daily Mail?

You choose not to buy certain goods because of atrocities from 80 years ago, but you don't mind supporting a paper that supported the Nazis?

You do know how the Mail got the nickname (and continues in much the same vein) of 'The Daily Heil', don't you?

https://www.timesofisrael.com/how-br...se-for-hitler/

https://www.globaljustice.org.uk/blo...ory-daily-mail

It's like a Scouser buying 'The Sun'.

[seivad]

I said 'Labour supporters and one anarchist' because they were the posters on this thread who
1. posted a cartoon of Nazi's and referenced the Daily heil.
2. Speculated my choice not to buy German goods was 'racist'
3. Made accusations of intent I did not harbour.

No far right or Tory posted.

It is all very well in hindsight telling me what I should and should not have put you must bear in mind because my intent was innocent I had no idea why and where you and SF were going with this.

If I was guilty of your allegations then I view the discussion from my point of view in an even worse light than the principle.

Until your posts I was not aware Mr BS (being a new poster)knew that I was Jewish.
I was giving is distasteful comments and cartoons fair reply until SF jumped in.

Why don't you re read the thread this time from my point of view not SF's?

I've read and reread this thread from all perspectives ad nauseam. My opinion hasn't changed.

I've no idea if Mr BS knew that you were Jewish beforehand, but given the current discussion I'm sure he's aware of it now.

At every opportunity you paint the Labour party with a very broad anti-Semitic brush, often based on spurious information from the right wing press. It should come as no surprise that members refute your opinion, and sometimes fling distasteful comments your way.

[AdmiralAckbar]

Seriously?

Inappropriate post to me at this time on this thread.

It is unfortunate that you are struggling to defend your posts at this point in time, but that was a genuine and serious response to something you had posted ... absolutely nothing wrong with the content.

You could grumble about the timing I suppose, but correcting inaccuracies (in this case, addressing false accusations regarding ignorance amongst Labour supporters) is best done in a timely manner.

[silver fox]

That does not help put right what you have given me which is burning injustice.

I harboured none of the sentiments SF or you accused me of.
My replies were a follow on conversation against the accusation of MR BS that I had 'Nazi sympathy's for reading the 'Daily heil'.

I did not deserve the barrage of abuse from either of you.

Just to make it clear my comment to you "You are also a Labour Supporter' referred to you backing up SF and other Labour poster accusations on that thread.
I thought I pointed it out politely.It seems you took it on personally
by your replies and it also deepened the injustice.

You are entitled to your bias(on backing up Labour opinion) and I do understand SF's and your sensitivities on the the subject but as I said
burning injustice just does not go away.

Your post blackening Labour supporters was quite clear and direct, your comment unsuprisingly, was not well recieved, but having read through the thread have failed to spot where I was abusive at all, certainly no barrage of abuse, you have thrown in comments ref; the Daily Mail, I can't see where I made comment ref; that publication in any way.

However it appears in your thinking I am the arch villian, probably because I am not a compliant Tory, whatever floats your boat.

[Hamble]

But you choose to support the Daily Mail?

You choose not to buy certain goods because of atrocities from 80 years ago, but you don't mind supporting a paper that supported the Nazis?

You do know how the Mail got the nickname (and continues in much the same vein) of 'The Daily Heil', don't you?

https://www.timesofisrael.com/how-br...se-for-hitler/

https://www.globaljustice.org.uk/blo...ory-daily-mail

It's like a Scouser buying 'The Sun'.

Why do I support the Daily Mail?
I don't buy it.
I read all the front pages of newspapers courtesy of the BBC home page.

Other posters quote from the Mail.


plus

Quote
"The paper's support ended after violence at a BUF rally in Kensington Olympia in June 1934.[47] Mosley and many others thought Rothermere had responded to pressure from Jewish businessmen who it was believed had threatened to stop advertising in the paper if it continued to back an anti-Semitic party.[48] The paper editorially continued to oppose the arrival of Jewish refugees escaping Germany, describing their arrival as "a problem to which the Daily Mail has repeatedly pointed."[


The papers support ended in 1934 which predates the war

[Hamble]

I've read and reread this thread from all perspectives ad nauseam. My opinion hasn't changed.

I've no idea if Mr BS knew that you were Jewish beforehand, but given the current discussion I'm sure he's aware of it now.

At every opportunity you paint the Labour party with a very broad anti-Semitic brush, often based on spurious information from the right wing press. It should come as no surprise that members refute your opinion, and sometimes fling distasteful comments your way.

Of course Mr BS knows now.
You gave a very full post with your views including religious advice.

It was a Labour supporter who started the thread on "does antisemitism exist" and invited a discussion.

Labour voters post the most extreme comments on all politicians
and Tory's get the most abuse without censure so I think that point
is untrue as well as unfair.

[Hamble]

Your post blackening Labour supporters was quite clear and direct, your comment unsuprisingly, was not well recieved, but having read through the thread have failed to spot where I was abusive at all, certainly no barrage of abuse, you have thrown in comments ref; the Daily Mail, I can't see where I made comment ref; that publication in any way.

However it appears in your thinking I am the arch villian, probably because I am not a compliant Tory, whatever floats your boat.

This is a good example of how you read go off on the wrong tangent.
I stated MR BS posted the Daily heil comment.

It is abuse to be condemned in such terms for something I did not do.

Its not as if this was a one off.
I have always been courteous to you.

[Hamble]

It is unfortunate that you are struggling to defend your posts at this point in time, but that was a genuine and serious response to something you had posted ... absolutely nothing wrong with the content.

You could grumble about the timing I suppose, but correcting inaccuracies (in this case, addressing false accusations regarding ignorance amongst Labour supporters) is best done in a timely manner.

Yes I am sorry AA.

You will understand that at the moment my heart is not in anything other than proving my innocence.

Plus any replies I give may be taken and used against me.
Hope you understand.

[silver fox]

This is a good example of how you read go off on the wrong tangent.
I stated MR BS posted the Daily heil comment.

It is abuse to be condemned in such terms for something I did not do.

Its not as if this was a one off.
I have always been courteous to you.

Sadly you didn't specify who you were responding to over the Mail, just included it in your Labour supporter bashing.

OK, just post on here where and when I have been abusive, remember not agreeing with your opinion is not abuse, as far as always being courteous to me, only very recently your "dinosaur" comment, I could retrace, but frankly can't be bothered.

Show where I have been abusive and you will most certainly receive unreserved aplogies, otherwise, old advice, "when you're in a hole, stop digging"