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  1. Little Londoner says:25/05/2021 04:45 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by salus.populi View Post
    We better bring back the horse and cart for those who think everything should remain Victorian then. The fact is many of Southport's roads are considerably wider than most towns. You could sail the Titanic down Cambridge Road.
    What do you suggest, Liverpool Rd approaching Birkdale Village, compulsory purchase of houses to widen the road to let TWO cars pass let alone cycle lanes. Yes Cambridge Rd is Wide but that is irrelevant when all traffic is down to ONE lane at the Cambridge Rd/PNR/Marshside Rd traffic lights as there will be no right turn lanes, perhaps the empty cycle lanes could be used if going straight on.

    I'd love to go back to the heady days when all goods came in by train and all workmen pushed a handcart with all their tools and requisites for the job in hand but if you think a little whatever you have in your home, bar any antiques left to you by Aunty Gertie, come by ROAD even the contents of Mosscrops shop wasn't ridden here it was delivered by a VEHICLE. Funnily I can't for the life of me think why the WIDE Waterloo Rd wasn't designated perhaps money talks louder than you think or some high ranking Council Official lives down there.






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  3. salus.populi says:25/05/2021 05:20 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Little Londoner View Post
    What do you suggest, Liverpool Rd approaching Birkdale Village, compulsory purchase of houses to widen the road to let TWO cars pass let alone cycle lanes. Yes Cambridge Rd is Wide but that is irrelevant when all traffic is down to ONE lane at the Cambridge Rd/PNR/Marshside Rd traffic lights as there will be no right turn lanes, perhaps the empty cycle lanes could be used if going straight on.

    I'd love to go back to the heady days when all goods came in by train and all workmen pushed a handcart with all their tools and requisites for the job in hand but if you think a little whatever you have in your home, bar any antiques left to you by Aunty Gertie, come by ROAD even the contents of Mosscrops shop wasn't ridden here it was delivered by a VEHICLE. Funnily I can't for the life of me think why the WIDE Waterloo Rd wasn't designated perhaps money talks louder than you think or some high ranking Council Official lives down there.
    I was suggesting there are plenty roads that are wide enough to have cycle lanes installed on them without any impediment to traffic.

    I don't see the need for reducing 2 lanes to 1 at Cambridge Road lights, nor do I see the need for the convoluted arrangements for cycle lanes at the lights or the ridiculous idea for 2 separate cycle lanes to merge into a 2 lane cycle lane at the roundabout at the other end which all look frankly dangerous to me.

    Every new cycle lane that is installed seems to take a different style and format which only serves to confuse cyclists and drives alike.

  4. salus.populi says:25/05/2021 05:23 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by libraryguy View Post
    Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
    (etc)
    W
    Whats so funny? How wide is your car?
    I'm pretty sure there's plenty room for a metre wide cycle lane either side of here without impeding your progress.
    https://www.google.com/maps/@53.6601...7i16384!8i8192

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  6. Little Londoner says:25/05/2021 07:07 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by salus.populi View Post

    I don't see the need for reducing 2 lanes to 1 at Cambridge Road lights, nor do I see the need for the convoluted arrangements for cycle lanes at the lights or the ridiculous idea for 2 separate cycle lanes to merge into a 2 lane cycle lane at the roundabout at the other end which all look frankly dangerous to me.
    If you read the thread title and then the press release from Sefton posted by Roving Eye it states THREE times that the Lanes at Churchtown Lights are going to be reduced to One lane for traffic and one lane for the invisible pavement rats.

  7. libraryguy says:25/05/2021 08:12 PM
    So... if you have 10 cars in each of two lanes stretching back 500 yards, with a dedicated cycle lane, you will then have 20 cars in one lane stretching back 1000 yards taking twice as long to get through the lights.

    This when a lane has been designated for the sole use of cyclists and it'll be empty 99.8% of the time.

    You increase congestion and therefore increase air pollution from idling cars. Not all cars have stop - start technology, and it's going to be a very long time before everything is electric.

    Sefton Council are hell bent on destroying Southport!

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  9. salus.populi says:25/05/2021 08:35 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Little Londoner View Post
    If you read the thread title and then the press release from Sefton posted by Roving Eye it states THREE times that the Lanes at Churchtown Lights are going to be reduced to One lane for traffic and one lane for the invisible pavement rats.
    I'm well aware what it says.
    I'm saying I'm in favour of cycle lanes at the side of roads that are wide enough to accommodate them.
    I'm not in favour of every aspect of the proposed schemes such as reducing lanes of traffic.
    Is that simple enough for you to understand?

  10. salus.populi says:25/05/2021 08:38 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by libraryguy View Post
    So... if you have 10 cars in each of two lanes stretching back 500 yards, with a dedicated cycle lane, you will then have 20 cars in one lane stretching back 1000 yards taking twice as long to get through the lights.

    This when a lane has been designated for the sole use of cyclists and it'll be empty 99.8% of the time.

    You increase congestion and therefore increase air pollution from idling cars. Not all cars have stop - start technology, and it's going to be a very long time before everything is electric.

    Sefton Council are hell bent on destroying Southport!
    The 2 lanes are currently not and never have been 500 yards long.
    The current single lane carriageways on Cambridge Road only split into 2 lane approx 80 yards from the lights.

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  12. lawed143 says:25/05/2021 08:49 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by libraryguy View Post
    So... if you have 10 cars in each of two lanes stretching back 500 yards, with a dedicated cycle lane, you will then have 20 cars in one lane stretching back 1000 yards taking twice as long to get through the lights.

    This when a lane has been designated for the sole use of cyclists and it'll be empty 99.8% of the time.

    You increase congestion and therefore increase air pollution from idling cars. Not all cars have stop - start technology, and it's going to be a very long time before everything is electric.

    Sefton Council are hell bent on destroying Southport!
    How long are these cars.? 10 cars, 500 yards.? Now I know you haven’t a clue what you’re talking about.
    You do know the junction in question don’t you.? I don’t think you do....
    Travelling north or south, it’s majority left lane traffic queuing as the right lane is usually blocked by right turning traffic. Infact northbound is already a single lane straight ahead, as right lane is right turn only.
    Coming south, any right turning vehicle blocks the straight ahead option so most vehicles take up the left lane to go straight. It’s a merge to single file immediately after the junction anyway.

    So really, already it’s a single lane junction already. In the proposals, there are dedicated positions in the junction for right turning traffic, allowing other traffic to continue. Albeit sometimes right turners may cause a short delay at busier times.

    Really, IMO it’s not going to make any significant alteration to travel times through the area.

  13. MICK/GILLY says:25/05/2021 08:52 PM
    I can see it now, all is clear, indicators flashing brightly, the lights are changing and some Nob on a bike comes up the inside of me while I am attempting to turn left.
    My left hand mirror has saved more lives than Florence nightingale, nowerdays while turning left at lights my road position is such that bike lane or not there’s no room on my near side to pass .. like it or not.

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  15. lawed143 says:25/05/2021 09:04 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY View Post
    I can see it now, all is clear, indicators flashing brightly, the lights are changing and some Nob on a bike comes up the inside of me while I am attempting to turn left.
    My left hand mirror has saved more lives than Florence nightingale, nowerdays while turning left at lights my road position is such that bike lane or not there’s no room on my near side to pass .. like it or not.
    This is why segregation is needed. Cos of idiots like you, who think you can do what you like. Filtering is legal...it’s in the Highway Code. You would also be breaking the law by crossing over in front of a cyclist coming up a cycle lane on your nearside. Check the highway code, you’ll learn a bit and make everyone safer.
    Your attitude to other road users is unacceptable.
    You’re a danger, and should give up driving.

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  17. silver fox says:25/05/2021 09:08 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by lawed143 View Post
    How long are these cars.? 10 cars, 500 yards.? Now I know you haven’t a clue what you’re talking about.
    You do know the junction in question don’t you.? I don’t think you do....
    Travelling north or south, it’s majority left lane traffic queuing as the right lane is usually blocked by right turning traffic. Infact northbound is already a single lane straight ahead, as right lane is right turn only.
    Coming south, any right turning vehicle blocks the straight ahead option so most vehicles take up the left lane to go straight. It’s a merge to single file immediately after the junction anyway.

    So really, already it’s a single lane junction already. In the proposals, there are dedicated positions in the junction for right turning traffic, allowing other traffic to continue. Albeit sometimes right turners may cause a short delay at busier times.

    Really, IMO it’s not going to make any significant alteration to travel times through the area.
    Now you really are talking rubbish, reduce the traffic lanes to one coming into the lights just one or two right turning vehicles will block all traffic, you even state in your post that right turning traffic now reduces the junction to effectively one lane, put the right turning traffic into that same one lane and everything stops.

    Currently travelling from Cambridge road to PNR, there is a red lane on the nearside, I have seen more than enough suicide jockeys (usually of the lycra clad variety) who seem to think they can barrel straight on through the junction no matter what is actually happening as regards left tuning traffic.

    No problem with provision for safe cycling lanes where possible, but this current obsession with closing roads or parts of roads is not practical, particularly for the numbers of cyclists who actually use cycle tracks.

    Yes we have all heard the PNP's lament that provide the facilities and cyclists will appear in their thousands, absolute garbage, the bike is good for local transport for one person only and that is dependent on weather and ability, most of the time only dedicated cyclists will be out and about, the rest of us will bugger off elsewhere in our cars.

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  19. libraryguy says:25/05/2021 09:10 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by lawed143 View Post
    How long are these cars.? 10 cars, 500 yards.? Now I know you haven’t a clue what you’re talking about.
    You do know the junction in question don’t you.? I don’t think you do....
    Travelling north or south, it’s majority left lane traffic queuing as the right lane is usually blocked by right turning traffic. Infact northbound is already a single lane straight ahead, as right lane is right turn only.
    Coming south, any right turning vehicle blocks the straight ahead option so most vehicles take up the left lane to go straight. It’s a merge to single file immediately after the junction anyway.

    So really, already it’s a single lane junction already. In the proposals, there are dedicated positions in the junction for right turning traffic, allowing other traffic to continue. Albeit sometimes right turners may cause a short delay at busier times.

    Really, IMO it’s not going to make any significant alteration to travel times through the area.
    I know cars are not that length, I was putting forward an argument that if you have 2 lanes taking up a certain amount of space, if you close one lane you will automatically double the line of cars in the queue in the single lane.

    I know the junction very well as I pass it most days!

  20. lawed143 says:25/05/2021 09:14 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by silver fox View Post
    Now you really are talking rubbish, reduce the traffic lanes to one coming into the lights just one or two right turning vehicles will block all traffic, you even state in your post that right turning traffic now reduces the junction to effectively one lane, put the right turning traffic into that same one lane and everything stops.

    Currently travelling from Cambridge road to PNR, there is a red lane on the nearside, I have seen more than enough suicide jockeys (usually of the lycra clad variety) who seem to think they can barrel straight on through the junction no matter what is actually happening as regards left tuning traffic.

    No problem with provision for safe cycling lanes where possible, but this current obsession with closing roads or parts of roads is not practical, particularly for the numbers of cyclists who actually use cycle tracks.

    Yes we have all heard the PNP's lament that provide the facilities and cyclists will appear in their thousands, absolute garbage, the bike is good for local transport for one person only and that is dependent on weather and ability, most of the time only dedicated cyclists will be out and about, the rest of us will bugger off elsewhere in our cars.
    You haven’t even looked at the schematics have you.? Go take a look, then come back to me. Within the junction, there is space for right turning vehicles to wait, allowing traffic to proceed straight on unhindered. Yes there will be times when there might be a small delay, but rarely.
    Take five ways heading towards Ormskirk. That’s a single lane straight on, with a right turn wait-point in the junction and it works just fine.
    It’s time to grow up and stop being a big me me me sissy. Mummy will be up soon to tuck you in.

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  22. lawed143 says:25/05/2021 09:18 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by libraryguy View Post
    I know cars are not that length, I was putting forward an argument that if you have 2 lanes taking up a certain amount of space, if you close one lane you will automatically double the line of cars in the queue in the single lane.

    I know the junction very well as I pass it most days!
    So you KNOW it’s practically already a single lane straight on from both directions.
    Therefore it’s not really a problem then is it.?
    Just more moaning cos you’re losing like 2% of the tarmac and can’t cope with it and are having a hissy fit....
    boohoo. Get over it.

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  24. local says:25/05/2021 10:12 PM
    It's quite amusing these cycling lanes, I don't mind them and find some ok for me but I have to say I am often on my own in them.

    They usually introduce traffic delays and increased pollution which isn't much fun when your cycling or walking.

    I like entirely separate ones but these roadside botch ups are generally useless for the environment and encouraging cycling, for which they clearly are an abject failure.

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