Discussion of Sports

[said]

For an honest discussion without Drama Queens or histrionics - what is your view of Transgenders competing in World Class sport?

"Caster Semenya’s gender is uncontroversially female. She is legally female, was from birth raised as female and identifies as a female." The Conversation.

Her father said that as a child she would never wear female clothing.

Her wife is now expecting their second child.

Laurel Hubbard who has recently taken part in the Tokyo Olympics is a transgender weight lifter. Until the age of 35, she took part in Men's weight lifting competitions - although talented, she would never have reached the high standards required.

In short, pre-transition Laurel was talented, but not a world-calibre athlete.
The question then becomes: Is Laurel Hubbard the person advocates want to be the face of transgender policy?
The question is rhetorical because the answer is obviously “no”.
Having an individual who spent most of her adult life as a man, transitioning at age 35, as the face of a movement will surely spell disaster for any real transgender policy from ever taking effect or even being considered.
Although it should not be the case, anecdotes make policy, and Laurel Hubbard is a totally unsympathetic character upon which to make policy decisions.
If she wins a medal, she will highlight the fact that men should not be competing in women’s sports, that it is patently unfair.
The only thing people will notice is that an above-average male lifter just placed at the Olympics as a woman, and that the laudable efforts of other women were devalued, in real terms, because of that. Inside The Games.

[Hamble]

Sport should accept it Trans competitors in team events.

In women's individual events why not have a joint winner fastest/best/highest scorer.
That way no one is disadvantaged all respected.

[joan ofarc]

I don't see how Laurel Hubbard's character, sympathetic or otherwise, has anything to do wih the question of whether or not a trans can compete with the gender they identify with.
I notice you use the pronoun 'she'.
Laurel bombed out of the competition I believe so good enough to get to the Olympics but not very far. The question probably won't arise next time.

My twopennies worth is that trans should have their own category of competition.

[Little Londoner]

It says it all when a female born a female with all the requisite parts of female anatomy is barred from competing yet a bloke who has not got one iota of femininity is allowed to compete with the opposite sex.

To put it in context can a fan of Greyhound racing raise a Jaguar cub as a dog and enter it into the Greyhound Derby NO so what is the difference.

Fortunately the ability of the weight lifter showed through and I doubt he'll be seen again.

[Kippax]

My twopennies worth is that trans should have their own category of competition.

And what about the other 50+ genders we are told now exist, we wouldn’t want to offend, upset or exclude anyone.

[Toodles McGinty]

The problem with transgender athletes lies in the Olympic rules.

Apparently the rules state if a person 'identifies as' a woman, they are allowed to compete against women. And of course, they have to meet the hormone criteria. But basically, if they've lived as a woman, without gender reassignment surgery, for a certain amount of time they can compete.

It's all a bit grey. I think a whole lot more research has to be done comparing cis-gender women to women who've transitioned but still have the bone, muscle, heart and lung advantages of males who've gone through puberty. Maybe they should compete with a handicap - weights, times etc.

I don't think there are enough trans athletes to compete in their own categories.

In the case of Hubbard, it was all immaterial, as her snatch failed.

[local]

Is it my puerile mind?


In the case of Hubbard, it was all immaterial, as her snatch failed.


Small (Who Knows) things amuse small minds and all that

[Kippax]

Is it my puerile mind?


In the case of Hubbard, it was all immaterial, as her snatch failed.


Small (Who Knows) things amuse small minds and all that

I must admit, it made me smile.

Her snatch failed on more than one count, allegedly.

[Toodles McGinty]

Is it my puerile mind?


In the case of Hubbard, it was all immaterial, as her snatch failed.


Small (Who Knows) things amuse small minds and all that

Some things just write themselves.

[local]

It probably isn't PC, but in the immortal words of Frankie Howard;

"Titter ye not"

[Kippax]

.

[joan ofarc]

The problem with transgender athletes lies in the Olympic rules.

I don't think there are enough trans athletes to compete in their own categories.

There aren't now. Who knows what the next three years will bring.

[joan ofarc]

And what about the other 50+ genders we are told now exist, we wouldn’t want to offend, upset or exclude anyone.

I am only thinking about the ones that affect the body to give an advantage to one over the other. Not going to think about DSDs as well. It all makes my head hurt.


When I was a kid I remember being puzzled by my parents' reaction to boys with long hair. 'You can't tell if it's a man or a woman,' was the usual complaint.To me there was no problem telling genders apart but I am starting to relate a bit now to my parents' feelings- the world is getting mighty complicated.

[Hamble]

Truth is disadvantage stalks all athletes from height to weight to injury to advantage in training and funding.

At the moment Transgender competitors on the whole go late to cross over sex and have to wait 2 years to meet hormone level clearance.
Add to that operations and mental abuse I feel reluctant to support any more disadvantage to individuals.
The scrutiny on their sex authenticity is positively humiliating.

As mentioned before I would rather reward.

[Hamble]

It probably isn't PC, but in the immortal words of Frankie Howard;

"Titter ye not"

There is always a longer queue to penalise.