And not a single bloody cyclist to be seen. It looks deserted. Well done Pratt n Pillock.

Originally Posted by The PNP

You haven't taken into account, the fact that the provision of a safe route across town, will encourage more to switch from car to bike for those trips. Not only reducing pollution, but reducing congestion and reducing demand for parking space too - it's clearly a win-win all round!

From my own observations it is abundantly clear that the vast majority of cyclists are leisure and pleasure cyclists, including of course the lycra clad numpties who think it's OK to occupy chunks of road by riding two abreast on single lane roads, who in their right mind wants to cycle round or through town?

Sure there are a good number who use a bike to get to trains etc, but that is pretty well the end, how many actually use the bike for anything else? your pipe dream of provide cycle lanes and cyclists will appear in droves, is pie in the sky in a linear town like Southport, the vast majority passing through town, do not travel through town, the coastal road is a good bypass, apart from of course anyone coming in from Ormskirk direction.

Please remember your lifestyle which you seem to think is superior to others, is not for everyone, by a long way.

Originally Posted by silver fox

From my own observations it is abundantly clear that the vast majority of cyclists are leisure and pleasure cyclists

Which in itself is pretty odd, considering the majority of bike trips in places where adequate infra exist, are for getting from A to B. This is particularly so in urban areas, yet as you say, that's not been the case in Southport . There must be a reason for this, as with our flat terrain the town is obviously ideal for bike-usage.

If only people would refrain from blocking safe cycle infra schemes and gave it a chance, we'd see a real increase in cycling's modal share.....Until that happens, relatively few who currently drive will feel confident enough to jump on a bike for their everyday local trips.

Originally Posted by The PNP

Have you ever been down there when it's at its full height in a storm? Tell you what mate, it's frightening....And a couple of hours is all the sea will need, to breach those defenses and flood the town - what then?

You really do type some of the most ridiculous tosh anyone could read with that statement.

Do you seriously think that the current sea wall would not prevent any breaches by high tides? Utterly illogical.

Before the sea wall was built around the pier area, Lord Street use to flood fairly regularly because the Promenade is at a higher level and water/rain water would cascade down Nevill Street for a start (the sea came right up to the Prom at that time at very high tides), but never happened since the mid-1980s.

Originally Posted by The PNP

You haven't taken into account, the fact that the provision of a safe route across town, will encourage more to switch from car to bike for those trips. Not only reducing pollution, but reducing congestion and reducing demand for parking space too - it's clearly a win-win all round!

But, contrary to your view, it doesn't and it hasn't. The number of cyclists on Queen's Road and Hoghton Street hasn't risen in any significant number since the scheme was introduced, yet in reality it should be the time of the year when that would be expected to happen for a while.

All that has been created are more difficult times for businesses in the area and frustrating detours for vehicle drivers trying to reach to deliver or visit family or friends' properties in surrounding streets.

Originally Posted by The PNP

Have you ever been down there when it's at its full height in a storm? Tell you what mate, it's frightening....And a couple of hours is all the sea will need, to breach those defenses and flood the town - what then?

Free funding? At least it didn't mean an increase in our Council Tax bills, so what's not to like? This isn't some crackpot scheme put on random roads. It's the only safe way for riders to get from one side of town to the other, i.e. from the vicinity of Hesketh Park to the Birkdale area, without getting squished in heavy traffic.

I have been down there I have lived here all my life and seen how the sea goes out ever more every year soon we will be the only town with a pier in a field with cows grazing beneath it and it’s not frightening at all and there are cycle lanes on the sea wall and it’s not likely to flood the town twice a year and what’s not to like is the road closures, the loss of business, the inconvenience for many of the towns elderly and disabled and the nonesense of it all when hardly anyone uses these lanes and the funding is being taken and wasted just for the sake of it, the whole thing is disproportionate to cycles that don’t use these lanes and to spout that there’s some kind of benefit to the climate is just tin foil hat fodder for those that are determined to allocate this free money to those they choose, to friendly companies, what next a mono rail or escalator to nowhere.
https://youtu.be/7I95rdKhWD0

Originally Posted by Stuartli

But, contrary to your view, it doesn't and it hasn't. The number of cyclists on Queen's Road and Hoghton Street hasn't risen in any significant number since the scheme was introduced, yet in reality it should be the time of the year when that would be expected to happen for a while.

And I suppose you've been along to see for yourself? If you had, you wouldn't be guessing as you obviously are....Fyi, I have spent time at the junction of Hoghton/London St - and guess what? There are in fact a reasonable number of bikes using Hoghton St to get in/out of Chapel St.

Don't believe it? Go spend a good ten minutes there e.g. around lunchtime and you're likely to see several bikes go by - not to mention a private car or two, running the no-entry on London St towards the Monument!

We have all been down there we all see how much a folly it is all the time.

Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

We have all been down there we all see how much a folly it is all the time.

I counted a good half dozen bikes in/out of Hoghton St, last time I parked my bike by that corner. Which multiplied over a day, adds up to a decent amount of bike traffic, considering most will have had to ride along unimproved roads to join the route..

You are a one man ( with a handful of friends/accounts) preaching your personal agenda to a WHOLE TOWN that has ALREADY REJECTED these ridiculous dangerous lanes and road closures by a VAST majority and still the council want to grab any money they can to waste or to allocate to who knows who, it’s all backwards it stinks it’s wrong but it still carries on in front of our very eyes, the council either don’t care what the actual people want and have voted against or they are just taking us for mugs while the cash is distributed amongst them. Sometimes I can’t work out if you are part of the councils plans or just someone that has never grown out of riding a bike or nuts or both .

Originally Posted by Stuartli

You really do type some of the most ridiculous tosh anyone could read with that statement.

Do you seriously think that the current sea wall would not prevent any breaches by high tides? Utterly illogical.

The seawall is just man-enough to do the job at present...but in time will certainly be breached. That is, unless it is beefed-up more and periodically raised another metre or so.

Question is, how long will Govt's feel it's cost-effective to keep putting money into sea-defence schemes, when the cost of doing so, outweighs the cost of retreating and relocating coastal communities further inland?

Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

You are a one man ( with a handful of friends/accounts) preaching your personal agenda to a WHOLE TOWN that has ALREADY REJECTED these ridiculous dangerous lanes and road closures by a VAST majority and still the council want to grab any money they can to waste or to allocate to who knows who, it’s all backwards it stinks it’s wrong but it still carries on in front of our very eyes, the council either don’t care what the actual people want and have voted against or they are just taking us for mugs while the cash is distributed amongst them. Sometimes I can’t work out if you are part of the councils plans or just someone that has never grown out of riding a bike or nuts or both .

And tbh, I can't work out why some people are so opposed to the notion of making life safer for bike-users? You may have no intention of ever getting on a bike and fair enough, I accept that to be your choice. However, there are plenty who very likely would, if they perceived it to be safe to do so. This is the group at which safe infra is aimed.

Originally Posted by The PNP

The seawall is just man-enough to do the job at present...but in time will certainly be breached. That is, unless it is beefed-up more and periodically raised another metre or so.

Question is, how long will Govt's feel it's cost-effective to keep putting money into sea-defence schemes, when the cost of doing so, outweighs the cost of retreating and relocating coastal communities further inland?

No it won’t be breached by a twice a year high tide that with a bit of wind blows water over onto the road, the sea is ever retreating and has been doing steadily for at least a hundred years and anyone that remembers Peter pans and the cafe on stilts will also remember the dates etched into the curbs showing the high tides over at least a hundred years and that was 50 yrs ago, it showed where the highest yearly tide came up to years ago ..and every year and how it’s retreated significantly year by year and it’s retreated far out to sea in my lifetime, if the sea wall wasn’t there twice a year at the highest tides the sea would barely cross the road to pleasureland , I know as I used to work there before the wall was built and that’s as far as it came then.
The very idea that the ever distant Southport sea will cross Europe's biggest car park and breach the sea wall that is super strong and cost millions is just ridiculous fantasy, next you will be saying the moon is made of green cheese or the sky will fall in, breach the sea wall indeed, you want to listen to yourself, raise the wall by another meter or so, It’s unlikely we will have to relocate further inland it’s more likely there will be cows grazing at the end of a pier in a field in 100 yrs . Your living in a fantasy world you really are

Originally Posted by The PNP

And I suppose you've been along to see for yourself? If you had, you wouldn't be guessing as you obviously are....Fyi, I have spent time at the junction of Hoghton/London St - and guess what? There are in fact a reasonable number of bikes using Hoghton St to get in/out of Chapel St.

Don't believe it? Go spend a good ten minutes there e.g. around lunchtime and you're likely to see several bikes go by - not to mention a private car or two, running the no-entry on London St towards the Monument!

So, in other words, you've precisely proved my point (which is not a guess).

Several bikes "likely to be seen around lunchtime" just about sums it (and your deluded mind) up, along with your probably false allegations of private cars going down London Street towards the Monument; it's something I've rarely seen over many years.

Originally Posted by The PNP

And tbh, I can't work out why some people are so opposed to the notion of making life safer for bike-users? You may have no intention of ever getting on a bike and fair enough, I accept that to be your choice. However, there are plenty who very likely would, if they perceived it to be safe to do so. This is the group at which safe infra is aimed.

If you remember I told you I had a top electric bike that I experienced pure joy riding, I re learned how vulnerable and dangerous cycling is, I rode as my father taught me with respect for safety and cars, riding properly close to the curb not undertaking or shouting at motorists, I rode single file often dismounting at perilous crossings. I used mainly back streets, rode through parks and on pavements that were not so busy. I never once thought stopping the whole town and closing roads for my personal gain was acceptable nor did I acquire an inferiority personality disorder from being on the oldest of slow moving most disliked mode of transport their is. I just quietly went along businesses stayed open the climate stayed the same and no one was inconvenienced.