Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

Even a little crying baby knows to look back before pulling out, you shouldn’t really need to be told that . You should look back before pulling out and look back after you pull back in. And if you come up to a parked car after looking back and seeing a line of vehicles you should stop and wait before pulling out in front of them any parent would teach their children this maybe you missed out on this making you think you can do what you want .. but you can’t because it’s just like stepping out onto a busy road and thinking the world will stop for you, Common sense will keep you alive, record what you want you won’t be at the screening if you ride like you preach .

Wrong...It's mirror, signal, manouevre, as any driving instructor will tell you. So yes, look back and make eye contact by all means (though your ears should tell you if something's behind anyway), put out your right arm, pass the obstruction and move back over to the left - simples!

Originally Posted by The PNP

Wrong...It's mirror, signal, manouevre, as any driving instructor will tell you. So yes, look back and make eye contact by all means (though your ears should tell you if something's behind anyway), put out your right arm, pass the obstruction and move back over to the left - simples!

Yea look again I was editing and writing that as you posted this and saying that I’ve never seen a cyclist look back and then signal but if there are real vehicles coming they should stop and wait like old ladies do that’s how they have stayed alive so long by overtaking IF IT IS SAFE TO DO SO, electric cars make little noise and it’s “not by all means” it’s sort of compulsory and you should look back after you have pulled back in, ask any driving instructor that aswell and if you don’t know why you should have a think about it .

Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

Yea look again I was editing and writing that as you posted this and saying that I’ve never seen a cyclist look back and then signal but if there are real vehicles coming they should stop and wait like old ladies do that’s how they have stayed alive so long by overtaking IF IT IS SAFE TO DO SO, electric cars make little noise and it’s “not by all means” it’s sort of compulsory and you should look back after you have pulled back in, ask any driving instructor that aswell and if you don’t know why you should have a think about it .

I do the same thing whether driving or riding. The only time I'd come to a halt behind a parked car, would be if oncoming traffic prevented me from going straight past. If I do end up waiting, my right indicator will already be on, or right arm will be out. Your suggestion of effectively parking behind a parked car and waiting till everyone from behind has gone by, would result in a fail for being too timid. Apart from which, you'd never get anywhere, driving or riding in fits-and-starts like that!

Obviously you wouldn’t wait until cars passed you while you were driving a car and waiting for oncoming traffic to flow past but there is a difference you know, for a start on a bicycle you may not have to stop for oncoming traffic while cars stop behind you but as you say if you look back and look a driver in the eye you are better stopping before you signal and manoeuvre as you are too close to them for them to stop or change course especially on a faster rd . So if you are looking a driver in the eye they will already be passing you and the parked car and at that point you have no real safe option other than to stop and can’t be overtaking the parked car as it’s NOT SAFE TO DO SO. You can only go on a green light if it is safe to do so just because it’s green means nothing. ( like when you go through red ones ) .
Look back signal out look back pass look back signal in and look back is what you and everyone else should be doing .

Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

Obviously you wouldn’t wait until cars passed you while you were driving a car and waiting for oncoming traffic to flow past but there is a difference you know, for a start on a bicycle you may not have to stop for oncoming traffic while cars stop behind you but as you say if you look back and look a driver in the eye you are better stopping before you signal and manoeuvre as you are too close to them for them to stop or change course especially on a faster rd . So if you are looking a driver in the eye they will already be passing you and the parked car and at that point you have no real safe option other than to stop and can’t be overtaking the parked car as it’s NOT SAFE TO DO SO. You can only go on a green light if it is safe to do so just because it’s green means nothing. ( like when you go through red ones ) .
Look back signal out look back signal in and look back is what you and everyone else should be doing .

Only difference, is in what I'm driving or riding - other than that, I treat situations pretty much the same.

But you are right to highlight the 'bike overtakes parked car' scenario, as it's one where riders are at increased risk. The reason is nothing to do with the rider, but with the way human vision works......

We register outlines of objects first, then fill-in the detail within. I.e. a driver approaching a parked car/van/truck etc, will recognise the object as being what it is and steer right, to avoid it. Crucially however, he may not have registered the outline of a cyclist, because it is contained within the outline of the larger object. Which on occasion results in cars hitting cyclists, as outline of cyclist only appears to the driver once the cyclist has pulled clear of the larger object. By which time, it's too late for the driver to avoid sending the rider flying through the air - which is why eye-contact between rider and driver is a good idea.

Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

Even a little crying baby knows to look back before pulling out, you shouldn’t really need to be told that . You should look back before pulling out and look back after you pull back in. And if you come up to a parked car after looking back and seeing a line of vehicles you should stop and wait before pulling out in front of them any parent would teach their children this maybe you missed out on this making you think you can do what you want .. but you can’t because it’s just like stepping out onto a busy road and thinking the world will stop for you, Common sense will keep you alive, record what you want you won’t be at the screening if you ride like you preach .


It’s not their responsibility to facilitate your overtake. Use your eyes, observations, appropriate speed (20mph), and plan ahead.

No it’s your responsibility to look back signal and then pull out IF IT IS SAFE TO DO SO, that phrase is all over the law and the Highway Code and it’s your responsibility to stop if it’s not safe. There’s a little phrase us real drivers use on the road it’s Mirror, Signal, Manoeuvre ( if it’s safe to do so ) it’s a lifesaver. Has anyone ever seen a cyclist signal past a parked car, I only ever see them look back half the time it’s their responsibility to overtake safely or stop, car drivers are not mind readers and I know cyclists haven’t got much to read but indicating is a big thing on the road, if you ever became proper tested road users you would know that.

You’re obviously not up to date with the latest HWC rules. Maybe refer to them before making up what you think you know.

Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

Obviously you wouldn’t wait until cars passed you while you were driving a car and waiting for oncoming traffic to flow past but there is a difference you know, for a start on a bicycle you may not have to stop for oncoming traffic while cars stop behind you but as you say if you look back and look a driver in the eye you are better stopping before you signal and manoeuvre as you are too close to them for them to stop or change course especially on a faster rd . So if you are looking a driver in the eye they will already be passing you and the parked car and at that point you have no real safe option other than to stop and can’t be overtaking the parked car as it’s NOT SAFE TO DO SO. You can only go on a green light if it is safe to do so just because it’s green means nothing. ( like when you go through red ones ) .
Look back signal out look back pass look back signal in and look back is what you and everyone else should be doing .

What a load of tosh.

Originally Posted by lawed143

What a load of tosh.

Anyone that has just passed a motorcycle test should tell you this it’s a big thing and just glancing moving your eyes in your mirrors won’t do as the examiner wants to see you looking back over your right shoulder and anyone with common sense and is aware of what is around them at all times on the road will also tell you this but you ride how you want, you can lead a horse to water but if it’s as stubborn as a donkey it will make an a$$ of itself .

Originally Posted by lawed143

You’re obviously not up to date with the latest HWC rules. Maybe refer to them before making up what you think you know.

Just remember , IF ITS SAFE TO DO SO . The HWC is big on that. And you are not up to date on the recent AE waiting times .

Originally Posted by The PNP

Only difference, is in what I'm driving or riding - other than that, I treat situations pretty much the same.

But you are right to highlight the 'bike overtakes parked car' scenario, as it's one where riders are at increased risk. The reason is nothing to do with the rider, but with the way human vision works......

We register outlines of objects first, then fill-in the detail within. I.e. a driver approaching a parked car/van/truck etc, will recognise the object as being what it is and steer right, to avoid it. Crucially however, he may not have registered the outline of a cyclist, because it is contained within the outline of the larger object. Which on occasion results in cars hitting cyclists, as outline of cyclist only appears to the driver once the cyclist has pulled clear of the larger object. By which time, it's too late for the driver to avoid sending the rider flying through the air - which is why eye-contact between rider and driver is a good idea.

I still think if you are able to see the whites oft the drivers eyes it’s best to stop and wait and that applies to me aswell if I venture on a bicycle I am not just preaching to others I would do the same and practice what I preach or go on the pavement as many do. Nobody wants to have a bicyclist hurt or have one cause an accident and kill us all.

Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

I still think if you are able to see the whites of the drivers eyes it’s best to stop and wait and that applies to me as well, if I venture on a bicycle. I am not just preaching to others, I would do the same and practice what I preach or go on the pavement as many do. Nobody wants to have a bicyclist hurt or have one cause an accident and kill us all.

Eye contact can be made a lot further away, than at such close quarters as that. Same at roundabouts and going past side-roads, etc. Even driving, I still watch the other driver, to determine if they've seen me approaching or not. Because if they do pull out on me, I want to be able to do something about it in time.

Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

Anyone that has just passed a motorcycle test should tell you this it’s a big thing and just glancing moving your eyes in your mirrors won’t do as the examiner wants to see you looking back over your right shoulder and anyone with common sense and is aware of what is around them at all times on the road will also tell you this but you ride how you want, you can lead a horse to water but if it’s as stubborn as a donkey it will make an a$$ of itself .

No, let’s not move from cycling to motorcycling and make out that the requirements to pass a bike test are the same as the rules that a cyclist must follow. You’re alL over the place.
Please point to the specific law you are referring to. You won’t be able to, cos it doesn’t exist. What you think a cyclist should do, and what the law allows them to do (and protects them with) are two completely different things. MickGilly doesn’t get to stipulate the law, but certainly tries to impose his own ideals on everyone.

Originally Posted by MICK/GILLY

Just remember , IF ITS SAFE TO DO SO . The HWC is big on that. And you are not up to date on the recent AE waiting times .

Just remember - cyclists and pedestrians are at the top of the hierarchy in the HWC rules. Know your place, give cyclists room, and remember - we are recording you.

Originally Posted by The PNP

Eye contact can be made a lot further away, than at such close quarters as that. Same at roundabouts and going past side-roads, etc. Even driving, I still watch the other driver, to determine if they've seen me approaching or not. Because if they do pull out on me, I want to be able to do something about it in time.

If I take to the roads on two wheels I don’t trust anyone, I don’t care if they are indicating I let them turn first before I set off as they could have left their indicator on. Once I was going over Rose hill looking straight in the eyes of a driver turning out of Kensington rd and he waited until I was right on top of him to pull out in front of me so no when people flash or wave you on I wouldn’t go across them at a junction I would let them go first. Maybe it’s my training that’s kept me alive and even paid off in later life with 4 wheels but I am intelligent enough to know I don’t know it all and any given second you could be quite dead given circumstances unseen.
Saying that tho I am not perfect, I have heard people say ooh he went too fast on the coast rd one guy said on here he did the ton on the coast rd and got berated. I have had many bikes and many many friends with bikes and in Mcc’s ( and still have ) and I actually don’t know anyone that hasn’t done a ton on the coast rd . Ha ha yea …still nowerdays 30 yrs later I plod on like an old dude I have no need of speed I quite like just ambling around on 4 wheels I thought of getting a massive bike again but then I would have to ride it and I’ve got nowhere really to go, you can only amble around town so much and rivington on a Sunday so I’ll probably leave it for now.
All this cycle lane nonesense and bicycles is just tosh to a proper biker but as a driver it beggars belief how they can get away with riding the oppose way than our parents taught us so well, like 2 abreast and in the middle of the road and with contempt for motorists. If my father saw me riding a bicycle this way he would have taken it off me with a slap and that’s what I think should happen today.

Originally Posted by lawed143

Just remember - cyclists and pedestrians are at the top of the hierarchy in the HWC rules. Know your place, give cyclists room, and remember - we are recording you.

Yea record yourself on your stupid little bicycle in AE just remember to take the stabilisers off. I am pointing to the law of common sense the only law that you will need to keep you alive on that little lollipop stick paperweight of a contraption you venture onto the Queens highway on in with proper traffic .