Johnson's incompetent leadership helped send Covid victims to early graves

[Tentill4]

How's the weather there in Stockholm?

Oops, missed this reply..

8 degrees - Sunny intervals changing to partly cloudy by early evening

Sunrise - 0720
Sunset - 1747

https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather...ate=2021-10-13

[Toodles McGinty]

I find it extremely disturbing, the not entirely unexpected, that the Tory tribe, Carrie and the Boris Boys can't accept the findings of an enquiry led by Tory MPs. Even when that enquiry lays the unnecessary deaths of thousands directly at Johnson's feet. Anybody But Boris.

I also find it a relief that not every Tory MP is in the thrall of the ERG and the rat haired psychopath. That there are some in the party that actually want to serve the country rather than line their own pockets with (usually) Russian money. It bodes well for a return to one nation Toryism when this bunch have made enough cash for themselves and their buddies.

All this 'nobody knew' and 'it was unprecedented' is bull. For starters, everybody with 2 brain cells to rub together knew that a pandemic was inevitable. Not 'if' but 'when'. They ignored the findings of several pandemic planning operations. They didn't prepare. Even before Johnson, they cut services through austerity and ignored vital recommendations. They condemned thousands to death purely down to negligence before we had a single infection.

They are blaming scientists they ignored, just as they blamed firefighters for Grenfell. Or they blamed teachers for not particularly wanting to go into classrooms chock full of infection - but don't provide the means to make it safer.

Johnson, as he always does, announced idiot policies. Then the public react. Then he u-turns. 'I've been shaking hands...I've been in hospitals with Covid patients..' etc. We, the public, could see what was happening abroad. Most of us were aghast at the lack of action by the government. We knew we had to lock down in February. We knew the Cheltenham and Champion's League matches would spread the virus. We were, initially, weeks behind the events of Italy and Spain.

But the message, always, is criticism before the event is 'scaremongering'. During the event is 'unpatriotic'. After is 'it's all very well with hindsight'. But don't lay the blame where it actually belongs. Never.

Now we're in a situation where on average, the UK is seeing 36,000 daily cases of Covid and 180 deaths each day. The same as a 747 crash every day. The daily rates are triple what they were one year ago and the daily deaths are twice the amount of one year ago. But according to the government, we're 'coming out' of the pandemic. Misinformation, inaction, bull. Which is that: scaremongering, unpatriotic or hindsight?

I don't know if official enquiries can lead to criminal proceedings. I hope so, because some need to pay for all of the unnecessary deaths. 150,000+ grieving families should get justice.

[Alikado]

Great you have read some of the problems now tell me what to prepare for next and how?


I forgot to answer the much repeated PPE nonsense

from the Guardian, we had a lot;

[I]That stockpile is made up of around 52,000 pallets of equipment worth an estimated £500m.

The problem was distribution and which disaster to plan for.

Still our armchair hindsight Professors will get around their crystal balls and tell us what's coming next.

Link please.

You and the Guardian must have known something the Government & the NHS didn't as they wasted £m's on PPE contacts with Pest Control Companies and blokes down the Boozer buying stuff some of which wasn't upto standard and not fit for purpose.

[Alikado]

You can't dodge the question, the scientists did advise them, they followed it and yet you still criticise.

Come on tell me, do I need a hard hat, a mask or a gun for the zombies?

The Scientists only advise on the Science and provide a range of options and opinions to input into the decision along with advice from other relevant bodies such as the Forces and Emergency Services, the decision which is then taken is by the Government. To claim they 'Only following the Science' is either saying they ignored the input from all other bodies or they are trying to dodge all responsibility for the decision, they made so they own it.

[Toodles McGinty]

That stockpile is made up of around 52,000 pallets of equipment worth an estimated £500m

Link please.

You and the Guardian must have known something the Government & the NHS didn't as they wasted £m's on PPE contacts with Pest Control Companies and blokes down the Boozer buying stuff some of which wasn't upto standard and not fit for purpose.

Here's the link. Revealed: Private firm running UK PPE stockpile was sold in middle of pandemic

Not quite the 'we had enough equipment, we just couldn't distribute it'. More 'Incompetent, corrupt Tory government hand in glove with yet another American health care provider'.

In three years, the stockpile appears to have been stored in three different warehouses. Meanwhile, management of the stock has been passed from a German–owned multinational to an American one.

In the coming months the custody of the UK’s emergency stockpile of PPE will be passed on to a family-run business based in suburban Paris.

I'd bet hard cash that some Tory donor or other has their fingers in the pie. A tale of typical incompetence. They seem to have taken the film 'Idiocracy' as a workshop manual.

[seivad]

Great you have read some of the problems now tell me what to prepare for next and how?


I forgot to answer the much repeated PPE nonsense

from the Guardian, we had a lot;

[I]That stockpile is made up of around 52,000 pallets of equipment worth an estimated £500m.

The problem was distribution and which disaster to plan for.

Still our armchair hindsight Professors will get around their crystal balls and tell us what's coming next.

Why do you call it PPE nonsense? Although the stockpile may seem large, and it was primarily in readiness for an influenza pandemic, the stockpile still didn't hold the estimated requirement for some types of PPE deemed necessary for a flu pandemic. For Covid, four of the items in the stockpile would only last for two weeks.

Read key points from the National Audit Office report, starting on page 6. They also cover the distribution issues, and problems encountered due to selecting Movianto to warehouse and distribute PPE. Their contract stating that on notification of a pandemic, stockpiled PPE should be distributed 4 weeks after notification. Hardly a lightning response. No checks on stockpiled PPE. Some had passed their expiry date. Others didn't meet current safety standards. Even if you had only experienced a flu pandemic, the stockpile was inadequate.

The report also covers the purchase of PPE, and problems encountered with substandard products.

https://www.nao.org.uk/wp-content/up...9-pandemic.pdf

This chart shows the estimated number of PPE items that should be maintained in the stockpile(s) for a flu pandemic, and what was actually being held. It also gives the number of days the stock would last in the Covid pandemic. I'm sure that many countries were caught short, but to claim otherwise is ridiculous. As is the claim that future purchases of PPE were as smooth as silk. 2020 was absolute chaos.

[Stuartli]

The inquiries mentioned that the Government hadn't made sufficient provision to tackle a potential pandemic if and when it became reality, yet Jeremy Hunt, one of the chairman, was Health Minister from 2012 to 2018.

[local]

Link please.

You and the Guardian must have known something the Government & the NHS didn't as they wasted £m's on PPE contacts with Pest Control Companies and blokes down the Boozer buying stuff some of which wasn't upto standard and not fit for purpose.

No problem is it inconvenient ?


https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...le-of-pandemic


The health secretary, Matt Hancock, insists the government is rising to the challenge, and has repeatedly said the PPE challenge has been “one of distribution rather than one of supply”. In addition to procuring new supplies from China, the DHSC has been drawing on the emergency stockpile, which it has stored since 2006 under its pandemic influenza preparedness programme.

That stockpile is made up of around 52,000 pallets of equipment worth an estimated £500m. While it contains antiviral medicines and flu vaccines which are of limited use against Covid-19, the bulk of stocks are said to be PPE and hygiene products.

[donkey22]

The inquiries mentioned that the Government hadn't made sufficient provision to tackle a potential pandemic if and when it became reality, yet Jeremy Hunt, one of the chairman, was Health Minister from 2012 to 2018.

And your point is?
It just reinforces that there’s been a history of poor decision making.

[local]

Why do you call it PPE nonsense? Although the stockpile may seem large, and it was primarily in readiness for an influenza pandemic, the stockpile still didn't hold the estimated requirement for some types of PPE deemed necessary for a flu pandemic. For Covid, four of the items in the stockpile would only last for two weeks.

Read key points from the National Audit Office report, starting on page 6. They also cover the distribution issues, and problems encountered due to selecting Movianto to warehouse and distribute PPE. Their contract stating that on notification of a pandemic, stockpiled PPE should be distributed 4 weeks after notification. Hardly a lightning response. No checks on stockpiled PPE. Some had passed their expiry date. Others didn't meet current safety standards. Even if you had only experienced a flu pandemic, the stockpile was inadequate.

The report also covers the purchase of PPE, and problems encountered with substandard products.

https://www.nao.org.uk/wp-content/up...9-pandemic.pdf

This chart shows the estimated number of PPE items that should be maintained in the stockpile(s) for a flu pandemic, and what was actually being held. It also gives the number of days the stock would last in the Covid pandemic. I'm sure that many countries were caught short, but to claim otherwise is ridiculous. As is the claim that future purchases of PPE were as smooth as silk. 2020 was absolute chaos.

It is nonsense because as was regularly stated the problem was about distribution we went from around 250 recipients of PPE from government (our) stores to over 50,000.

Thats, why the army was sent in the NHS delivery system couldn't cope and every shark in the world circled to make a buck out of PPE.

Personally I would shoot them Tory donors or not.

Nursing homes and others turned to the NHS because their normal suppliers as private businesses couldn't cope.

I couldn't get toilet roll am I to blame?

[local]

Here's the link. Revealed: Private firm running UK PPE stockpile was sold in middle of pandemic

Not quite the 'we had enough equipment, we just couldn't distribute it'. More 'Incompetent, corrupt Tory government hand in glove with yet another American health care provider'.

In three years, the stockpile appears to have been stored in three different warehouses. Meanwhile, management of the stock has been passed from a German–owned multinational to an American one.

In the coming months the custody of the UK’s emergency stockpile of PPE will be passed on to a family-run business based in suburban Paris.

I'd bet hard cash that some Tory donor or other has their fingers in the pie. A tale of typical incompetence. They seem to have taken the film 'Idiocracy' as a workshop manual.

Or is it,

I have gone back to my old friends at the Socialist Worker;

Despite the heroic efforts of healthworkers the NHS has been ill-prepared to cope with the coronavirus pandemic. But the roots of this lie in years of neo-liberal policies, including the marketisation drive in England of the New Labour governments of Tony Blair and Gordon Brown, argues JON DALE.

https://www.socialistpartywales.org....-covid-crisis/

Oh blimey what have I done

Isn't the reality that our country has dodged a bullet since the Spanish Flu epidemic and successive governments haven't done as much as they could have done.

Blaming Johnson is a bit lame he was a bit busy when this started rumbling I and obviously just me didn't think when the coaches went into Arrowe Park that a tsunami would follow.

I have seen many scares around respitory diseases throughout my life and thankfully they didn't get here.

Hang me out to dry but I didn't have pasta and bog rolls in bulk either.

[local]

Ah because they said they were following the science you take it at face value that a government of proven liars were telling the truth.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ng-the-science
You must be another one enjoying the climate in the Swedish capital.

You do of course realise that you smear the many scientists with the same brush?

[local]

None of our resident experts have yet told me what to prepare for next has Said hijacked your accounts?


Its obvious to you all just share it.

[local]

Given that the majority of voters who actually voted in the Brexit Referendum are likely to be the people that voted in the 2019 General Election, I find your second sentence rather strange. The majority voted for Brexit, likely the same majority who consigned a Corbyn led Labour Party to its heaviest Election defeat in 84 years. Labour would never, ever have won a GL with Corbyn at the helm.

But don't forget Starmer supported him.

Then you with your condemnation of Johnson wanted the alternative Corbyn.

With Judgement like that how can we take it seriously?

There was only two to vote in.

[silver fox]

But don't forget Starmer supported him.

Then you with your condemnation of Johnson wanted the alternative Corbyn.

With Judgement like that how can we take it seriously?

There was only two to vote in.

The election should have been about policy first, party second, instead it was a populist vote based on the leaders, Corbyn was not overly highly regarded even by Labour supporters, sadly the populist vote carried the day, something on the lines of assorted voting on TV “competitions”